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Let $X$ be a set with no topological structure but equipped with a notion of convergence. Assuming this notion of convergence satisfies some nice consistency conditions, we can define a topology on $X$ by defining an arbitrary subset $E \subset X$ to be closed if for any convergent net contained in $X$ its limit also belongs to $E$. Unfortunately, it can happen that the notion of convergence resulting from this topology might not agree with the original notion of convergence used to construct the topology. That is, if $x_\alpha \rightarrow x$ using the original notion of convergence, it might happen that $x_\alpha \rightarrow y$ in the constructed topology where $x \neq y$.

I am interested in what conditions are sufficient to ensure the two notions of convergence agree.


My motivation for this question comes from analysis where one frequently characterizes topologies by convergence. A few examples include:

  • The topology of pointwise convergence
  • The topology of uniform convergence
  • Weak topologies

There are many ways to define these topologies. For example, the topology of pointwise can be generated using the seminorms: $$\rho_x(f) = |f(x)|$$ and the topology of uniform convergence can be generated using the supremum norm $$\|f\| = \sup_{x \in X} |f(x)|.$$ The weak topology can be generated by requiring all linear functionals to be continuous.

Could one generate these spaces using only a notion of convergence? For example take a topological vector space $X$ and as above define a topology on it using closed sets defined by weak convergence: $$\phi(f_n) \rightarrow \phi(f)$$ for all continuous linear functionals $\phi$. Would this topology agree with the usual weak topology and preserve this notion of convergence?

Similarly, if I start with a function space $X$ whose elements are real-valued and define a topology using pointwise convergence and uniform convergence would it agree with the topology of pointwise convergence and the topology of uniform convergence? Would their notions of convergence agree?

CBBAM
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  • All the examples you cited work fine. The topology defined by saying a set is closed iff it contains all limits of nets in the set induces the same notion of convergence as the originally given notion of convergence, for any of the three examples. In fact, there are axioms characterizing when a notion of convergence comes from a topology (and when it does, the topology is always defined by a set is closed iff it contains all limits of nets in the set), see this Wikipedia article. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 05:56
  • @DavidGao Thank you. So it is always true that the two notions of convergence agree? I saw a few answers to other questions (e.g. https://math.stackexchange.com/a/2493769/823800) that suggest no, but I could not find anything more on this. – CBBAM Aug 19 '24 at 06:01
  • The answer you cited says two things: first, there are “notions of convergence” that do not come from a topology, say a.e. convergence of measurable functions (see this Wikipedia article), such notions of convergence necessarily do not satisfy the axioms listed in the article I linked to in my previous comment. These, instead, are known as convergence spaces. In general, if you try to define closed sets as those sets containing all limits of nets in them, you… – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:07
  • … don’t necessarily get a topology. You only get a closure space. Though, even then, the notion of convergence from this closure space will coincide with your original notion of convergence. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:09
  • The second thing the linked answer says is that there are distinct topologies whose notions of convergence on sequences are the same. This is certainly true, because topologies aren’t always fully captured by convergence of sequences. Those spaces whose topologies are fully characterized by sequences are known as sequential spaces. There are non-sequential spaces, such as $[0, 1]^I$ for uncountable $I$. For those spaces, just considering convergence of sequences is not enough. This is why I always said “nets” instead of “sequences” in my… – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:14
  • … previous comments: if you consider all nets, then a set is closed iff the limits of all nets in the set are in the set, and if you have a notion of convergence (for nets) which satisfy those axioms, then defining a set is closed iff the limits of all nets in the set are in the set gives you a topology whose notion of convergence is exactly the originally given one. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:16
  • @DavidGao The main part of that answer that threw me off was the following: "If you have a notion of convergence that satisfies reasonable properties then you can define closed sets to be those containing all their limits points with respect to this notion of convergence. This notion of closure satisfies the axioms. Therefore this notion of convergence defines a topology in this way. The problem now is that the topology defined this way induces another notion of convergence" – CBBAM Aug 19 '24 at 06:22
  • The last sentence seems to imply that the two notions of convergence do not necessarily agree. However your comments and the Wiki seem to suggest otherwise. How can one see that the two must agree? – CBBAM Aug 19 '24 at 06:22
  • Oh wait, my apologies, when the axioms for convergence are violated you still get a topological space, not just a closure space. I confused myself. But you will not get your previous notion of convergence back from the topology generated. You only get the a weaker notion of convergence (i.e., if $x_\alpha \to x$ in the original notion of convergence, then $x_\alpha \to x$ in the new notion of convergence as well, but the converse may not hold). – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:26
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    The linked answer, again, refers to a weaker set of axioms (those of convergence spaces, as I mentioned above), under which the two notions of convergence may not agree. Though even the linked answer remarked “In order for them to coincide you probably need to impose more axioms on the notion of convergence.” These “more axioms” are exactly the axioms listed in the Wikipedia article. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:31
  • I didn't notice the linked answer's axioms being weaker, but that clarifies everything now. Thanks for all your help! – CBBAM Aug 19 '24 at 06:33
  • The Wikipedia article has references for proving the axioms listed there are enough. The basic idea is that you use axiom 4 to show that the closure of a set is exactly the set of all limits of nets in that set (under the original notion of convergence), then use axiom 3 and the above fact to prove the new notion of convergence also implies the original. For technical details, check the references in the Wikipedia article. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:38
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    No problem. Glad to have helped. – David Gao Aug 19 '24 at 06:42

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